Ascension Penalties

Why do hard-earned resistance, potency, cool-down, attack-speed etc percentages DECREASE when you gain an ascension level?

This makes no sense to me and is a penalty - while the actual numbers stay the same the percentages drop (sometimes by as much as 3 % points).  For example with potency having worked to gain an increase on my items now find the damage increase for my powers is reduced (so a spell which did more damage before gaining the ascension level now does less)

This seems incredibly dumb to me and is another example of Flare punishing players for advancing

They do? Seriously? Do you have any proof? I have never noticed this phenomenon.

Yes, they do drop. The reason for this is simple: with each new ascension level you gain access to a much more potent gear, which has increased stats and health/dmg values. The devaluation is thus in place to balance the increase in raw values and does not really play a role, i.e. you can easily reach the same % values with new gear. Overall, this should not lead to any negative effects, hence I wouldnt say this a punishment, more so an act of balancing.

Yes I agree that gears lose effectiveness with each Ascension levels.But finding good cursed items rare though .

Like I found a gauntlet for Goddess Athena at Ascension level 94 that grants her 15 % demolition chance when I forged it to 5 star Titan but now at Ascension level 98 it is gives her only 10 %. :slightly_frowning_face:

But then again I have to look for a new item that will give her Demolition chance.

Ok. We find better items but not that balanced… For example my helen. She has near %62 when i was lvl 110s now she has under %50. (i am lvl 129). In my team a player 10 lvl under me can pass our top good defence with same hero/same equipments/same spells/same enhacements… But i can not… Same for statue, yes we are finding better equipment for perseus but resistances decrease in terms. Plus i start to think attack power of heroes started to be low then the map opponent’s defences. As well as odyseus missions, me and my team mates started to complain about even 7 skull for me most 6 skulls need invocation to pass. I think this handicap is harsh, devs must rethink to make this mechanics more smooth. 

Yes Hellslord I agree I am only at 98 Ascension level but My all heroes including Artemis can easily do 8 skull without dying and without use Invocations.I am worried what will happen when I will reach your level as you mentioned the same thing that @Dheth said

about Odyssey quest are too hard at high Ascension levels as compared to low one.Right now I am only concentrating at maximising spells and that is why odyssey quest don’t feel hard.

But I have no idea whether I will be able to do them at level 120+.

I will stop leveling up when I reach level 98 then in order to easily do 8 skull without dying. :wink:

I am 112 and I p2w from 105 to 112 in a single jump. So far not a single issue with 10 skull. So all and all, I would say that it really boils down to:

  1. Find yourself a good mentor that would advise things, there is a reason top players mostly reside within 127+ realm and can still do a lot of stuff. They are not the most vocable of people naturally, but some are very helpful indeed.

  2. Know the game mechanics, especially the end-game part. This is probably impossible without having 1), but there are A LOT more options when you are maxed in terms of equipment, comes down to knowing them.

Overall, I do see what you guys are saying, but the picture is a bit too grim and dark in my opinion.

I agree that when climbing from lvl you find better objects, the problem is for those who devote a lot of time and resources to improve cursed objects, that when they rise of lvl become weaker and as they are rare there are no similar objects consequently the hero loses a lot. I think we should do something for the cursed objects since “Power” “demolition” “give reflection” are very, very rare

@Sharknado they definitely drop - I have proof in that i track all my player stats in a spreadsheet and it is clearly visible.  Sorry @Infamous I think what you are saying is self justifying non sense - because you are talking about an ACTUAL step back for a POTENTIAL step forward.  There is *no need* to penalise us for doing the hard work for gaining an ascension level as well as having already spent a lot forging etc to get these items.  Your point about balance is arrant nonsense too.  It IS clearly a negative as I am now worse off.  It’s another case of Flare doing bad by its active players when there is really no need. Balance can be achieved by the mechanism of access to better items *maybe* * eventually* but you don’t guarantee it do you? It might take me ages to get another item of the same type for the same hero to redress that step back - if I EVER do

totally unimpressed by this and your simplistic answers

In my team i am the advisor i guess, i advice like these to them and want to advice good people sharing with me the forum,. I know some would not accept or tell i can do 10 skulls, i am like this powerfull, look my videos etc… I believe noone shares a lost batlle… FOR ME; Guys it is better not to increase your ascension lvl fast. Please do all your necessary spell/tower/ barricade blessings first. Then look for a slow ascension lvl up. If i had a chance to turn back past i would like to keep my ascension lvl between 110 and 120. Most of us thought including me we will be more powerfull when we reach lvl 130 but the truth is not like that. Some players in my team say that they feel themselves worthless and game somewhat stuck for them, even the reason is logical or whatever, it is hard to explain them, why they can not pass 7 skulls now or why map opponent’s defences started to become harder. Yes i know something about the mechanics,  but not everyone follows game chat as we do… Because there is a  general rule of gaming “when you get lvl up, you get powerfull”. I believe this too. Whatever is the reason after this balancing, hard to explain. Like hard to explain ascension lvl / trophies thing, like hard to explain higher lvl opponent stealing 25 now 15 trophies from, hard to explain war mechanics (soon will change hope be good). OR is a great game, we play more than a year, some play near 2 year… Game must offer a challenge for every lvl player, games must offer victories simply to keep people continue to play… Otherwise we loose players one by one… 

@Hellslord I get you - but who said anything about increasing fast? The reality IMPOSED by flare, is that if you want to boost uniques you *must* increase your ascension level. So - with respect - your reply is not really helpful to this issue

Hello Marcus. That was a real experience of my own. What i read at game forum at past :If you want more trophies then increase asc lvl.  If you want more powerfull item then increase ascension lvl… It was presented that the solution of everything is INCREASE YOUR ASCENSION LVL. What i did? I increased my ascension level really fast sometimes i increased the speed with gems… Every ascension lvl increase decrease heroe’s stats like %2. It makes a huge difference when the lvl ups are really fast. And can not be balanced with new items…Anyway that is what i think and my advice to active but currently  lower lvls, everybody is of coure is feel free to whatever to do… 

I kinda agree with @MarcusozInception on  Ascension level penalty.Like Right Now I have really good cursed items for Goddess Athena but after every Ascenion level gain they become useless.

 

With these items alone I can take on tough bases with her.Otherwise she will be a powerless Goddess.

Flaregames is increasing caps on defense which is a good thing but what about overpowered Persues and Ajax that simply won’t die no matter what type of troops or spells you use against them.

I really love playing with my all heroes but at High ascenion level I won’t be able to use Goddess Athena if she do not have potency bonus with demoliation chance.??? 

@HOLYDIVINE your Athena is very good, i like her

Well her resistance are over 90% and with 40% potency.so yeah she good against tough bases but don’t know what I will do after another Ascension level Gain.

I guess flaregames don’t Like Athena?.

I was not playing the game when they nerfed her too bad for new players Like me as they won’t know how Badass she was before her nerfing.

you’re right, flaregmes hates Athena

@MarcusozInception love the passion, keep the heat up. Now, if you wish a more elaborate answer, so be it. Consider for a split second the system you propose. A lvl 10player can have 3 resistance of 90%. Rare, but he very well could, especially if he pays money. Now, should there be no devaluation, by lvl 60 he would have had ALL resistances at 90% and by lvl 80 same would be true in defense, for he would have 2k to 13k increase in resistance points. And I dont even mention 90% demolition or regeneration. I dont know about you, but I can clearly see a problem. Every perseus is immortal by definition and every attack is so easy you can AM it and watch TV. Challenge? Nonexistent. 

Thusly, unless you have a bright and brilliant idea of fixing the issue I have just described, this wont fly. Now, in terms of gear. You can do with a minimum setup of resistances on most heroes. They would certainly be hard to use in wars, not to mention the fact they would not be special, but thats fine and intended. Would you feel the same if you were a person with an epic lvl 23 sword in, lets say, WOW, should this sword become considerably less effective against lvl 60 mobs? You are not guaranteed to get an epic sword on lvl 60, but the blue one would still do the job. This is once again a simple (unimpressive, I know) idea of the concept you are unhappy with the way I see it. I dont know whether ** are quotes or something, but I can in fact guarantee you are destined to get better gear as you level up. What no one would guarantee is specifically demolition or cooldown perks and no one should, really. They are special for a reason, with Uniques being the way to guarantee you a bonus for eternity (yes, this way has its flavs, I know).

Now, forging does indeed introduce discrepancy into the equation, as the system in place was most likely not designed to accommodate it. When you are of a low ascension, you would scroll through items very fast, as it was already mentioned by others. The issues come when you forge being higher up, as the stats go down, but there is no definitive or easy replacement for a fully forged titan set. This is indeed a thing and my idea would be to restrict forging to be the end-game mechanic as the very crude, unfair, and debatable idea. Should you remove the % decrease , the scenario outlined in the first paragraph would kick in.

Finally, consider the way MM works now. Lower level can attack higher ups and higher ups can attack lower levels. Guess what would happen, should there be no decrease? A low level would not be able to beat higher level, for higher level would have better perks by definition. Similarly, a higher level will be destined to beat the lower level by definition for the very same reason. In this scenario, having a cursed perk is indeed a boon, an advantage that rightfully devaluates with level. Otherwise someone with enouh cash would simply farm for the said perks and, well, see the first paragraph.

Overall, this is a VERY gentle system that should be viewed as a matrix. Devaluations have a vital role in many things, balancing being one and as far as I am concerned the most important one. Sometimes a step back is necessary, just like irl. Have a better way of doing it? Share, for I am not a developer and cannot singlehandedly imagine a “fix” fulfilling your desires that would not deeply wound the game like trophy system did. 

 

@Hellslord, I certainly agree with the idea of slow leveling, one of the best advices one can give. I also see your points regarding common gamer logic and would say they are all valid. My experience seems to differ, as I was the one locked by the trophy system for being “too good for my ascension level (bs imho)”, but thats fine, experiences are personal after all. I would really argue for a league system and broader gaps between ascension levels, currently the increase is so minor that there is almost no difference between levels 117 and 125, which is the issue your members seem to have. Otherwise, forge may very well be the only way to become “high level” again… If only there was a coherent guide made by FG officials.

so you think not level up unite and spell that someone not use ? to slow Down level 

The alternative would have been a very different game where either the % based system is thrown out completely (or % over 100% are possible, or the cap is continually raised on level up), or it would used fixed numbers so early level gear would be so weak that, for example, it might be difficult to get over 5% cooldown from any one item at level 75 but 10% is possible by level 100 or so, etc…  everything about the game would have to be rebalanced. 

if those % based stats didn’t need bigger boosts after you level up, the exact same gear you get at level 1 could still be useful at level 131. It would be a major problem. It’s annoying, but I can’t figure out a better way to do it. And I’ve tried.