NYX IMBALANCE

I think that shield (should block some morale drain) and some healing powers should restore some morale as one of the suggestions I originally made, would make asclepius a more useable power and give more use to cyclops for example

  1. Nyx work differently than every other tower. I agree with this. Charon towers also work differently than every other tower, including Nyx. I think that’s ok.

  2. It doesn’t matter whether units with higher morale get charmed slower (more “resistance”) or have a larger morale pool and the drain rate is constant. The end result is exactly the same. Resistance is an imprecise term here because it has a specific meaning in the context of this game, but it’s not incorrect in a wider sense. It’s semantics, but it might help someone who doesn’t understand the mechanic to think of it using both descriptions. 

Hi there, yes I have seen the thread. I will forward it to the devs. I hope to get an answer next week.

I don’t get how charon towers should be brought in to this, as they don’t do damage, their troops that they spawn obviously do (and their damage works in a standard way), and this is dependant on the tower lvl and ascension lvl. There is no strange imbalance with charon towers.

It does matter to an extent- It hurts to lose a phoenix to a nyx tower but no so much a spearman, NONE have resistance, the bigger troops you call to battle the less chance they have to be converted before you destroy (or not) the nyx, but the loss is greater if they do, it’s basically an educated gamble as to what troops to call. 

Try getting troops through the double nyx set up with Prom/Herc/Jason. Most people haven’t got 60%+ cd on these heroes OR more importantly a high enough lvl of pheme to reach these towers.

Nyx and Charon, while different, are more similar to each other than they are to other towers.

  • Neither one deals direct damage.
  • Neither one is affected by defense mode.
  • Both are more effective when they force a specific playstyle to manage them, either by forcing attackers to choose units or powers they normally wouldn’t, or by causing autoplay problems, or just changing the way a player would typically attack a defense.

I disagree that there’s any imbalance with Nyx. They’re just different. Isn’t that nice, rather than just having another direct-damage tower?

@dumpster Your analysis is wrong specifically the first point - there IS direct damage (so I don’t include charons in this debate)that affects morale (which is a type of health that is only used in this circumstance) and obviously when it reaches zero the troop is no longer yours (so is effectively dead) BUT it is worse as it switches sides never to return to your army even after the nyx is destroyed (another suggestion I made). For this reason a nyx tower should be treated by the AI as a higher threat than standard tower (another suggestion made). 

Your point about def mode is valid (not in relation to the charon towers as def mode works against the troops it spawns) as I don’t know if morale drain is reduced for nyx when troops are in def mode - a good question for the devs…It should be and I suspect it actually is slightly lower in def mode…

  1. Yes, that’s how it works. But that’s how direct damage works also. Bigger troops have more health (they should last longer) and cost more morale (you can call fewer of them), so it hurts you more when they die. I think that a balanced approach to calling units is usually wise.

  2. Hercules is still one of the most effective heroes in the game, and a well equipped hercules can single handedly get 95% on any defense or 10 skull odyssey. I think most will agree that prom is one of the weaker heroes right now, but he can also solo through defenses. He does more pure damage than any other hero. I choose not to play either one of these heroes much, just in the Odyssey, but Herc is incredibly popular and powerful.

Jason is also very popular because he can steamroll GKs if set up right. I don’t have 60K CD on him either and I don’t have any trouble with nyx towers. Even at low level, pheme has plenty of range to stun Nyx, or I use damocles with him. That’s fine for low cooldown builds.

Sorry you’re having trouble with those heroes!

Ok, glad you have all the answers! Keep on chooglin’.

(if you sit around in defense mode and let a charon spawn a bunch of troops on the opposite path you’re going to have a difficult time with the map.)

i really appreciate this, thx.

and also for the other points and hints you gave and for sharing your knowledge in a way and detail (and in a short time) i often would wish to get such answers directly from the devs.

it does not occour always, but it is just a matter of time. it happens sometime when i need more time e.g. to break trough barricades (more oddy points on them, more buffs from max. torch points), not the best brricade breaker hero or stuff like that. and a phoenix turnarround can be deadly - resoummoned troops, more time, other unnits turn too… you need to pay attention to that, running further with the hero is only good if it is a solo hero. because it can happen to be cut of totally - with this principle i was able to manage the brothers challenege.

maybe with the new levels, when even more time is needed this will happen more often ? but on the other side, heros and troops will hopefully also get better.

 

 

I have no clue if today Nyx still relevant. i have build one but still at level 1 because I don’t know if I lose my time to upgrade it if I do it. The Nyx i face right now are a joke but the number of Nyx have dropped a lots. Since month rarely i see Nyx maybe 1 or 2 on 20 raid at Ascension 80. Will see later but for now don’t seem to be relevant like when they was introduce in the game

but i like the idea when you destroy the Nyx we should recuperate our troops. Like Red Alert 2 when you fight a Yuri who control your units and when you destroy it you recuperate them

Yeah, they’re nothing like they used to be.

The last point is especially relevant given the morale values will always be the same for our troops so as the lvl of nyx increase the health of them goes up, but equally important the morale drain rate will increase probably by 20% thus our units will get stolen 20% quicker regardless of their lvl and health. 

hello Warriornator, it’s just a matter of ascension level, I fight every day against titans league players and 99.9% of these players use 2 nyx towers

yes, double nyx combo is used in titan league. at least like @vasudeva1 said i have “a few” on my map.

Spoiler

 

but imho nyx are not a big deal if you play manually (at least at lvl131, if you are lower lvl and you got paired with a lvl131 titan player i assume it is harder…). but when i try autoplay (i am doing this since approx. 1-2 weeks now with cadmos, because i got his autoplay unique), i had some difficulties with two types of layouts. what i do now is i use a hybrid playstyle - manual in the beginning (at least with respect to unit choice, sometimes also hero control) - here i prever trebuchet after first initial units. and i stick to them and protect them. once when they are working on 1. nyx (if they can be reached) i move to the second one. bevor older units arrive (with maybe already low morale) i give 2nd nyx new units to work on. and i also prever here not the highest units (but 1,or2 griffin in the mob are good), because when they turn against you i need them to be erased asap. if i use griffin or phoenix only, they got turned - no idea why they do not when dumpster plays them. when trebuchet work on 2nd nyx, i switch to autoplay. works well for me this way.

the other layout with two not reachable corner nyx - here i try to break trough as quick as i can and hope that i do not get cut off from the reinforement units. sometime i use fist of power there. or choose another non-autoplay hero.

sometime, when i have enough units to break faster trough barricades, i also try to get behind the nyx.

 

edit: marked text as spoiler ?? (just discovered this funtion?)

When you surround your big units with little units it provides them with cover. The big units should never get turned unless something goes very wrong. 

It’s the same tactic as fighting Apollo towers with no lightning resistance. The Apollo’s can only hit one target at a time, so if your hero is surrounded with spearmen he’s perfectly safe. Nyx can only attack a couple of units at once, so the griffin in the swarm of spearmen is protected. 

yes, that is what i observed also. 

Hi there, here the input from the devs :slight_smile:

We won’t be reducing the power of Nyx Towers in the near future. At the moment there are ways to deal with them at all levels, and while it’s true that units don’t gain morale via the Odyssey, the Nyx also doesn’t gain morale drain rate through the Odyssey. Units gain HP via the Odyssey and damage dealing towers gain Damage via the Odyssey to balance this out. The only thing you can do with Nyx is to increase its HP, which then also balances it out against the attack of other units. Although the AI of units dealing with Nyx could be improved, we believe this would currently negate Nyx as a useful tower. We will consider the input, and discuss potential changes, but nothing will change in the near future.

I hope this answers potential questions you have had. Thank you! 

That confirm what I tough. Yeah I have found a old video of last year on my PC where I have build 2 Nyx at level 10 and this have give me +54 gems. Wow Maybe I will retry 2 Nyx Tower and see if that give me gems like last year

They’re not nearly as strong as they were before the Helios tower was released and after the rounds of nerfs that followed, but they still work ok. Most defenses use 2, but most defenses use 2 or 3 of every tower. I wouldn’t use that as an indicator of strength.