underpowered units nd spells

frosters are very weak compared to similar units lyk pyro nd airblasters.with only 1 more moral pyromancer get double damage nd hitpoints than frosters,with that saying it’s range reaches upto 6.2 nd attack rate similar to frosters.tho similar playstyle frosters loose to pyro from moral to moral.id like to suggest a range of 6.1-6.2 nd 20% boost in HP nd DMG.

paladins r the most useless nd worthless units in the game!at high lvl they die easily,they have soo many obvious weakness esp Poision.their dmg is low.id like to suggest 0% Poision weakness,75%blunt nd piercing weakness,with increased dmg.

cannons r good units in early nd mid game,in high lvl all towers have 6+ range,even some lower moral units lyk pyro nd airblasters have 6.2+ range.tis makes cannons very vulnerable nd is used only in defence.

bladestorm is comparatively good now,bt not enough it only effective against few towers lyk lighting tower nd healtower.in order to effectively use this spell for current meta it needs to have a range over 6.2,with a current range of 4.5 nd for table to 5.45,it’s playstyle won’t differ much players still have to dive to engage few towers against which its effective.

 

Frosters should have a higher range imo. Otherwise, they’re okay because they’re the only unit that slows down enemies

Paladins: Get rid of weakness to ice or posion or reduce both to 50%. Healing paladins are very effective though if forged

Cannons don’t need any modification, actually I’d nerf them a tiny bit before making them even stronger.

Bladestorm should be fine with 4.5 range especially since you can forge it. Remember, it lasts for 5 seconds which is a long spell and has a pretty short cooldown time

Paladins are really usesless - since the beginning of the game.

Thank you for your feedback!

 

Frosters combined with the Dragofroster boost are really powerful, easily in the top 5 most powerful unit in the game, putting more range would make them totally unstoppable in offense. So it would not be fair for you, your defense would be defeated by anyone.

Frosters in defense are anyway close to you and usually in chokepoints, so adding more range would not affect their power so much either, and having different units with different ranges in defense allow more defense designs to be possible, instead of a single one that everyone use.

Paladins will not be useless anymore soon :slight_smile:

Cannons are fine I think, in both offense and defense.

Bladestorm had its range increased in the last levels, you can actually destroy heal towers from an opposite path with it now. Changes regarding the range might still be introduced in the future tho to make it really enjoyable to use :slight_smile:

So when can we expect this new update? :smiley:

Give to frosters a real blunt resistance and give them more health…

Bam, very good point! Frosters have no real blunt resistance since years. Most things that deal blunt damage do deal 4-10 times more damage to frosters as the 75% blunt resistance stat would suggest. E.g. Gargoyles deal not 25% (as they should, based on official resistance stat) but instead 250% of regular damage to frosters! So in practice, Frosters actually rather have a blunt weakness in fact… combined with their very low health, this causes them to die VERY easily. Let alone, a number of severe threats either outrange frosters (e.g. bombers, skull towers, firebolts, arbs, pyros) or simply are immune to frosters completely (e.g. LTs)…

with all due respect.max level nd max forged frosters with dragofroster is much weaker to its counter part dragomancers.pyro have 2 resistance that actually work,double health nd damage.i understand 4 moral unit is stronger than 3 moral unit,bt not by 100%.only advantage frosters have over pyro is slight speed advantage that doesn’t make a difference.

also id like to suggest 0% Poision weakness nd 100% ice weakness for paladins with 75% resistance to blunt nd piercing damage.

finally blade storm having a range of 6.2-6.4 won’t break the game since it’s only effective against blocks nd 2 towers.

in my opinion 20% damage nd health boost nd 6.2 range would even the gap bwt frosters nd pyro.

Okay thank you all for your feedback, they were all taken in account and tested, this is the result of our tests to be up very soon (I will be very transparent ^^):

  • Blunt resistance will be improved for every aspect of the game for Frosters!

  • Poison weakness is part of the Paladin since the start of the game and is its weakness (you can even see it in its official video, with tips on how to protect them from it). We will reduce the ice weakness to more than half to make it less weak to ice in general.

  • Bladestorm will be able to reach Lightning Towers in the opposite path now (yes, over 6.7 of range!) after forging its range.

 

All of this will be added to the watch list very shorty here so you can discuss it as well:

 

I hope it’s not just underpowered units and spells, but underpowered pals get some love too =)

@FTBI expect 6.7 range to be an error for bladestorm range. Pyro range 6.08 can hit LT and firebolts on adjacent lane. So something like that should be bladestorm range value to hit LT or firebolts.

So what is the minimum range of bladestorm required to hit LT in adjacent lane? Bladestorm range without forges is 4.0

After 15 forges (2% increment of range per forge) , max bladestorm has range 5.2. That’s definitely not enough. Based on minimum pyro range we need 6.08 range. So around 50 forges?

A lot of players who don’t skip cool down definitely aren’t going to forge the range, it will take us more than a year to be able to hit LT. Firestorm already hits them, so why on earth would any free player ever invest the pearls in that?

When the non forged range would be 4.5, it would be worth it, since under 20 forges, we could accomplish that under those conditions. 

i have been playing this game ever since it was released in windows platform,as u mentioned paladins trade mark poision weakness is exactly what players above 2.7k trophies don’t want to use.100% weakness,according to math (a unit takes double the damage),bt that doesn’t happen with paladins.max leveled nd max forged paladin die in less than a sec under snake tower.that not 100% weakness its far more than that.try at least 75% Poision weakness with 75% piercing nd blunt dmg resistance with lil bit more damage.

buff nd changes to bladestorm is most welcome,forcing players to use firestorm can b avoided.

resistance to frosters is most welcome.still it’s a ranged unit with the lowest range in the game.pyromancers can kill some towers on their own while frosters can’t.yes i knw frosters can slow,bt since recent updates its not possible.skull towers against which frosters wer good at easily gets killed before frosters have a chance or slow.skull towers range exceed ovr 6.2.froster would b fine bt since every range unit nd towers haveing range boost froster become more difficult to slow units since they die even before they can fire 1 ice ball.

 Max range of pyro is 6.2 nd the range required to rit lighting nd firebolt across lane is 6.9.to hit singe tower which is directly opposite.6.7 range give the speel an advantage to hit across the lane when ur between the two towers

In parallel or better known as adjacent lane it’s 6.08 for pyro required. I have firestorm 6.71 and that indeed hits exactly what you say, the opposite path. My pyro also has range 6.2, so I know the numbers.

Current max range unforged for bladestorm is 4. We never get improvements by forging higher than 30-50%. To make things clear, an increment of 67.5% is required to make bladestorm reach 6.7 range, that’s not possible with 2% extra per forge, unless… the range will be even improved more, for example to 4.5 or even 5.

So if what Flotthaboss is telling is correct, I will expect a range addition to bladestorm (hopefully no new spell levels required to reach it, although I expect that to be the case!) 

yea obviously,my bladestorm is forged to 36.2% range boost its max range is 5.45-5.46…so in order to reach 6.7 range it have to b give a range of 5 or above.may b they will add another upgrade level for bladestorm nd other spells that require similar upgrades.

I kinda agree that range disadvantages made life a lot harder for frosters… though, if FTB’s right and the frosters will soon get their true blunt resistance, they will be several times more durable against skulls, bombs, gargs etc, which hopefully will help to make them survive long enough to then attack back.

Anyway, regarding paladin - if poison is their one weakness (sure, looking into what the true % behind the displayed values is, won’t hurt), then you could think about using shield spell, similar as you might do for your king when dealing with a lot of snake towers.

ok say froster get 75% resistance to blunt dmg exact value.a bomb tower deals 3000dmg per shot nd skull tower deal 2600 dmg per bomb in a volly of 18.ndfroster get max health of 3k completely maxed nd forged.so bomb towers deal 750dmg out of 3000(seems good),bt skull towers deal 2600 per bomb at max nd 18 bombs in 2-3 sec tym span.2600*18,i might b slightly wrong so let’s say 2000 *18 this dmg will kill a group of frosters before they get a shot at skull towers regardless of the resistance the dmg is too high.unless v use shield nd monks.bt this doesn’t happen wen pyromancers face firebolt or even skull towers for that matter.

paladins r useless not only because of poision weakness.the poision weakness is way to high,50-75% weakness would b good.also why would any one use paladins with 3 moral 700 dmg wen a knight can deal double the damage with higher attack rate with cheap moral?lower hp can b compensated with shield,bt over all moral to moral knights r way more efficient choice.

wen ur half way through a raid nd summon a ogre,with 2-3 airblaster on opposite lane the ogre can reach the hero at very health,bt paladin that’s not the case.1 shot from mortar nd he dies with in seconds.thats wer paladin suffers a lot.a single mortar can kill a group of paladins while orge,wolf nd other melee units need 2-3 raged units to kill them ovr a period of tym.

Sure we are constantly looking at improvements, and we look at feedback of players as well and test them, feel free to suggest anything if something is on your mind :slight_smile:

 

By the way no worries, everything I said in my last message will only be an instant bonus for everyone, no need to overthink it or think of ways you might be tricked.

To be very transparent again (don’t take the numbers to be totally exact, this is an example): if you forged your range to 3% today, it will be automatically upscaled/transformed to 7% after we release these changes. If you currently have 20%, you will automatically have 50% after we release these changes. Instant bonus :slight_smile:

 

I’m staying at your disposal and I will of course read everything ^^

My ideas on things that need balancing:

Pals:

  • Aki - not useful, i don’t see many using it - maybe increase the damage.
  • Growl - same thing, no one uses it, the intimidate power is just not useful enough, imo.
  • Kaiser - i think it’s a bit OTT, with sonic blast AND gold bonus - perhaps lower sonic blast damage? Since Irmgard does about the same but with no gold bonus.

Beasts:

  • Twisted Archimedes - not useful in high levels, too weak to fire and piercing - i suggest removing fire weakness.
  • Primal Growl - damage is too little, increase it.

Troops:

  • Paladin - all of the reasons mentioned beforehand. Also, i remember the day when Paladins were weak to normal and poison. Not sure who came up with the strange idea of changing normal weakness to ice weakness. Change it back, since lots of things are weak to ice and nothing is really weak to normal.
  • Froster - just more health and blunt resistance is fine for me.
  • Gargoyle in offense - i feel that there needs to be some element of the gargoyle that makes it good in offense, which currently there isn’t, excluding insta-goyle.
  • Mortar in offense AND defense - mortar is not useful in offense as you progress throughout the game - people only use it in defense because black magic is useless against it.
  • Viking - too expensive. WAY too expensive. And why is he so obese and fat yet is faster than an arblaster??
  • Monk - it’s not weak or resistant to anything? Give it a poison weakness so it’s easier to defeat.

Towers:

  • Arrow tower - not used at all in mid to high level. Even the boost caps at 4/4 which is odd, and it doesn’t really help. Buff.
  • Gargoyle tower - People seem to have swayed away from Gargoyle Nest and since the frost tower has been buffed into a killer machine, why not this one? Double its damage to make it actually kill things, don’t make it stop and start attacking for no apparent reason (whose idea was that) and increase the range. Done.

Spells:

  • Toxic Cloud - I don’t find it useful. I think slowdown is the only thing that makes it good, but before level 8, it’s quite useless (In my opinion).
  • Stun - maybe used once in a blue moon, but otherwise not.
  • Heal - not sure it’s used in high levels, maybe decrease cooldown a bit.
  • Pal Flute - too expensive, reduce the cost.

Other random stuff:

  • Poison is neglected in game. Almost everything (exaggeration intended) is resistant to it; all the towers, even some units (Pyromancer?). This is what makes Mortars and Mummies ineffective in offense and defense.
  • In the whole game, only three (excluding Frost Ninja) things do ice damage. It’s a bit neglected too.
  • Loads of things are weak to fire - firestorm is overpowered, almost every new troop/tower introduced from monk and LT onwards is weak to it. And lots of beasts.
  • What about make some troops weak to lightning? That would be interesting, we are getting a lot of new lightning dealing troops/towers in the game - lightning spell should be next.

I’m sure there’s a lot more but i can’t think of anything else at the moment.